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tales from a fangirl
Dear People who manage Angel (as an interest) on Facebook 
16th-Sep-2013 05:48 pm
O Rly
If you're going to ask fans who their favorite character is, please use a promo pic that includes Cordelia fucking Chase. Using a s5 promo (probably because Spike was on it) pic is likely to cause some long time fans to regress and leave nasty, mean spirited comments instead of a straight-forward answer.


*this comment brought to you by near aneuryism-inducing rage*
17th-Sep-2013 02:50 am (UTC)
Ya think they're a bit biased?
17th-Sep-2013 04:55 am (UTC)
I think....I'm going to try to answer this with my big girl panties on instead of from the depths of my outraged fangirl soul...I think once they decided to take AtS in the direction they did at the end of the 4th season and the beginning of the 5th, they pretty much dropped everything that reminded the audience of that horrifying s4 crapfest storyline. In other words, Cordelia and Connor (and that oh-so-problematic actress that ruined Joss' shiny story). S5 was the new show, the new beginning, and they had this shining star in Spike, who was so popular with the fans - whether hated or loved, people talked about him. So I think that's probably why they used the s5 promo, Spike is in it, it was the season that was supposed to jump start AtS, yadda, yadda, yadda. But all I see is how it erases Cordelia - again - from the canvas. In a way Doyle wasn't. His legacy was the visions, and being the funny/tragic figure that tied Cordelia and Angel with their own history, separate from Sunnydale. Cordelia had NO legacy in s5. She was erased - Angel couldn't even remember what room she was in and that was supposed to be funny? - and forgotten except when it served the storyline. And even then, her story was wrapped up in a neat bow and we were supposed to be satisfied.

So yeah, I think they were biased in choosing that promo pic. :)

And I guess seeing it and that question kind of triggered me, huh. :P

Edited at 2013-09-17 04:56 am (UTC)
18th-Sep-2013 04:05 am (UTC)
I don't do FB, but whoa. Much as I love(d) Angel - Cordelia was an important part of the show - and they absolutely fucked up her role - and we know why: she got pregnant. Asshats. absolute asshats (and Joss: I'm lookin' straight at you. feminist...yeah right.

/rant over.
18th-Sep-2013 03:33 pm (UTC)
and we know why: she got pregnant.

And here's the real irony: Fandom talks a lot about Joss' Bad Dads but less often talk about his Dead Moms. Every literal or metaphorical "mother figure" on Btvs or AtS that I'm aware of ends up dead by the end of the series except for Drusilla who is already undead anyway, and Buffy, who dies twice (3 times if you count Villains). Joyce, Darla, Tara - whose own mother is already dead - Maggie Walsh.

I don't count the ones who appear only one episode and don't really matter (Sheila Rosenberg and Mrs Harris.)

With the Slayers, I can generously make a symbolic connection between them and the historical fact that childbirth was once the #1 killer of women in the West. But every single mom on both shows?

I recently read that Joss' mother died when he was young and his father sent him away to school. Which explains a hell of a lot - including an inability to see past his own history, apparently. (And people slam the hell out of Marti Noxon for drawing on her own life experiences.)

Joss: I'm lookin' straight at you. feminist...yeah right.

So much WORD. I'm always amazed at all the self-described liberal men who are theoretically feminists but treat real women like shit. (Hello, James Cameron and Bill Clinton.) Joss' history with the women who work for him unless they're his special snowflake is frightening and too much of a pattern to ignore.
21st-Sep-2013 08:24 pm (UTC)

My life experiences have been that men who call themselves feminists are The Worst Offenders.
21st-Sep-2013 08:37 pm (UTC)
Which is true of anybody I've ever known who claims "I'm not racist/sexist/homophobic/prejudiced, etc"
19th-Sep-2013 01:34 am (UTC)
Pretty much agreeing with everything. Try not to be TOO surprised. :P

Oh, except the FB thing. I wished I didn't do it, but I'm stuck now.
17th-Sep-2013 03:07 am (UTC)
Considering the fact that I can find tons of Spangel fic relative to "Cangel" (god I hate smushnames) or just Angel, Cordy gen, this? Does not surprise me.

I'm not sure how such a major character can get such short shrift in fandom - and I haven't even watched much of AtS. I'm just talking from a plain damn common sense viewpoint.

17th-Sep-2013 06:36 am (UTC)
Well, Spangel fic is pretty thick on the ground relative to just about any other ship, other than Spander or Spangel. Slash is prodigious compared to het ships imo.

However, you hit the nail when you say she's gotten the seriously short end of the stick. I don't know if anyone can say why with any finality. I can tell I think it's because she's the least identifiable of any of the characters. It's hard to relate to her because she doesn't seem to have the issues the other characters carry around like luggage. So there's less to explore, and because she was a Mean Girl, there's even less inclination to try.

I try because I admire her strength and her confidence but I also see the girl who wanted to be needed underneath the social butterfly. And I love how fair she was - she may not like Buffy a lot of the time but if a jock knocks Buffy down, Cordy's going to tell him off. Xander and Willow may have betrayed her trust but if Buffy needs a ride home, the only thing out of her mouth is "of course". That's what I love and adore about Cordelia, all those prickly thorns and surprisingly soft contradictions...

I'll stop now. I'm getting carried away. Thanks for commenting. :)
18th-Sep-2013 03:48 pm (UTC)
Slash is prodigious compared to het ships imo.

Even compared to Bangel or Spuffy? (FYI: one thing I've learned is that if Spike is mentioned in any conversation even as a sidenote it quickly becomes ALL ABOUT HIM.)

So there's less to explore, and because she was a Mean Girl

And I admit that watching the show for the first time last year she was the character I liked the least in the early seasons because in school I'd been the Willow/Marcie/Jonathan character at the receiving end of that kind of meanness from the time I walked into kindergarten onward. So I didn't have a lot of sympathy when she bemoaned the fact in S2 that people didn't see below her surface.

S3 completely changed that - Xander cheating on her with Willow and being IMPALED, for god's sake (was that necessary? To punish her for Xander's fuck-up? 'cause, he's the nerd-boy stand-in for Joss and his idea of "a man who is turned on by strong women" ?)

At that point I really wanted them to do more with her because Charisma's performance in the immediate aftermath was excellent. trying to go backwards with her character at that point was actually offensive.

I watched an episode or two of AtS in S1 and thought that I could really enjoy watching Cordy at that point and who she was becoming. Then I made the mistake (or not) of reading about the series and what happens to her - and the fate of every other female character on the series and I just can't go through that.

if Buffy needs a ride home, the only thing out of her mouth is "of course".

Helpless is one of my favorite episodes (I love Buffy but god help me I love angst); and that moment is one I've watched over and over. I love Cordy SO much in that moment. Or when she tells Buffy to "spank her inner moppet" in WSWB - they get each other on a level the show acknowledges too infrequently. Or in Ted after Buffy thinks she's killed a man and Giles says she shouldn't go on patrol Cordy's response is "What can we do?"

I think I'm getting carried away now, too.
17th-Sep-2013 07:12 am (UTC)
You go girl!!!

(I'd be pissed off too - hope that your brain did not explode).
18th-Sep-2013 02:18 am (UTC)
It didn't but it was close.

I was mad last night. Long, frustrating day = short fuse. I saw that and the fuse lit.

But I stand by it. :)
18th-Sep-2013 07:52 am (UTC)
Don't let the buggers get you down, they simply are not worth it.

Stands by with fire extinguisher for any further fuses lit.

Hope that this reply finds you in a happy place and if not, Happy Wednesday from me!
21st-Sep-2013 04:58 pm (UTC)
It doesn't surprise me. It happens on LJ all the time with AtS comms. I think part of it is just the newer fans started with S5 and probably have never bothered watching the rest of the show. And, yes, there are more Spike fans out there than any other character on Angel. But if I come across a comm that uses a S5 promo pic, I usually don't bother with it because I can see immediately that Cordy is not even on their radar so why bother.
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